Summary
Ontario will impose a 25% surcharge on electricity exports to New York, Michigan, and Minnesota starting Monday in retaliation for Trump’s tariffs on Canadian goods.
Premier Doug Ford warned U.S. governors and vowed to maintain the surcharge until all tariffs are lifted.
Canada has already imposed $30 billion in retaliatory tariffs, with more planned.
Ford also threatened to cut power to the states by April and banned U.S. firms from bidding on Ontario contracts. A $100M SpaceX deal for rural internet was also scrapped in response.
Kudos to the Canadians and Canadiens! I ordered another pair of Baffin boots, Made in Canada, last week.
Based Doug Ford was not on my 2025 bingo card.
When Trump said “America is back!” did he mean in the back of the line? Cause that’s where we’re at fellas.
In healthcare, we’ve been back of the line for decades.
Ironically, while Ford might be doing a pretty good job staying tough against Trump, he’s doing his level best to try to drive Ontario right to the back of that healthcare line as well. So save us a spot?
Why are mostly blue states getting punished for shithead? They should be focusing on red states. They’re the ones who voted for this nonsense.
I wonder if ON can impose a 25% surcharge solely on Michigan? Ultimately, it doesn’t really matter. Plenty of people from Minnesota (47%) and New York (43 %) voted for this nonsense.
Eh, upstate NY is probably all red, save for perhaps part of Albany. NY State and NY City are very, very different.
In addition to the other answers, there are still red districts in blue states, such as NY-21 currently held by Stefanik and has a large border with Canada.
Because, it turns out, that blue states and red states are part of the same country. I think it’s a stupid way to do things, but that’s what you guys have settled on.
I don’t know all the facts but maybe if more people.votrd in the first place Donald wouldn’t have won? Maybe not… But Americans should be pushing back and they haven’t done anything yet but complain online. Pushing any single one of them to take action is better than only attempting to punish the ones who don’t even care.
Unfortunately they are the ones getting power provided to them from Ontario.
Canada can’t exactly cut off power to Texas
However, we’re willing to export our Arctic Vortices to Texas free of any additional levies.
Texas handles their own outages perfectly well.
USA is USA.
People outside of the USA will treat you the same as you treat any other nation. Does trumps tariffs only target the liberal provinces?
Can they get the Fed to drop the F35 contract for a European platform?
Heres to hoping! Not if peepee gets in
Hold up - if there is already a 25% tariff - IE tax - on Canadian electricity, does that mean that there is now another 25% tax on that electricity?
And wouldn’t this have a slight compounding effect on the second us tariff?
Yes, but us postponed their tariffs another month.
Thing that sucks tho, is at this point it doesn’t matter if there’s tariffs or not, since people have started preparing as if there will be. Worse, tariffs get integrated into an economy and are next to impossible to un-do. God 45 is so stupid
No offense but Trump would welcome these on highly liberal Minnesota and New York and be impartial to Michigan. These are not affecting conservative states.
The states as a whole are liberal, but the rural northern parts are fairly conservative. It’s the northern parts that consume the bulk of the electricity imports
Yes. Unfortunately, it’s a very blunt instrument. The rest of our tariffs have been ultra-targeted, but Doug Ford really wants to do something and this is the main tool he has provincially.
There’s enough rural, conservative areas within those states that would be affected I imagine he’ll have some blowback. How much is hard to say at this point, especially given that he’s still adding and removing his own tariffs all the time.
Makes you wonder if this is the first phase of what he meant about “blue states completely disappearing off the map” next year.
punish the fucking pigs anyway.
It will affect the customers, who are rural. The states are blue, because of their cities, but the cities aren’t reliant on Canadian electricity. The rural areas are, and they vote red.
Do you have a source on that? I’d really expect they’re all on the same grid.
Of course they’re on the same grid. Most of the US is interconnected. The Eastern interconnect connects everything East of the rockies, excluding Texas
Prices are fairly localized depending on the cost of production at the plant nearest to you. Much of Southern Minnesota is fed by the Monticello nuclear plant, for example. It’s the northern areas where Canadian power generation isblargely used because it’s closer. It’s those places that will have try to get power from elsewhere in the upper midwest grid (if there isbany capacity), or pay the additional 25% tax
Do you really think the Trump supporters will connect the dots?
JD Vance showed how much he cares about rural communities in Hillbilly Eulogy. Rural Americans are just impressionable pawns to Trump and his ilk.
In the past when he refuses emergency assistance for blue states his advisers struggle to make him understand that the affected areas voted for him. Seems to struggle to understand or care beyond how an entire state voted.
To be fair, does it matter if it’s a blue state either way?
Well they are more closely allied with Canada than whatever the federal gov is doing by this point.
I’m not entirely sure he would care either way to be fair, but you do raise a good point.
The era of US-Canada being brothers in arms is over. I doubt US will be receiving any favors in the future without something in return. And if Canada chooses to expand their supply chains outside of the US, which they 100% should, there’ll be no coming back to a scale of trade as it exists today.
Trump doesn’t want Canada as a friend. They will just try and stop him from deals with Russia.
Canada - America trade amounts to a little over $920B https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/IF/IF12595
Canadian GDP is a little over $2.1T https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.CD?locations=CA
We’re talking nearly half of their GDP. In addition, half of Canadian foreign investment comes directly from the US. They will continue to be integrated into the US economy, even if Trump doubled the tariffs tomorrow.
And that’s because Canada, and Mexico to an even higher extent, are completely reliant on US trade. They both have no real choice but to grin and bear it. They will of course speak out publicly for the domestic audience but things will continue more or less status quo for the foreseeable future.
canada and Mexico are not “grinning and bearing it” though
Yes, they are. There will be no meaningful response because they have no leverage. Any meaningful change from status quo would mean an immediate economic crisis.
Ignore what they say on camera because they are speaking to their domestic audience.
Right now, Canada has placed a 25% tariff on $30B worth of imports. That’s 7% of US imports. Whereas Trump has placed 25% on everything that Canada exports to the US.
And 80% of Canadian exports go directly to the US.
So just for reference.
Canada retaliatory tariff -> $30B which represents less than 1% of total US exports
Trump’s tariffs -> ~$550B which represents nearly 80% of total Canadian exports
Ignore the rhetoric, look at the numbers. Canada and Mexico have no choice. They signed their economic autonomy away a long time ago. It’s sort of like when Greece went through their debt crisis and couldn’t do jack shit because they signed away their autonomy to Brussels (and really Germany).
There are trade-offs to every decision. Canada got easy access to the American market and a nice way to exploit their natural resources. But it also gives Washington an absurd amount of leverage over them.
Mexico is even more screwed.
I’m not disagreeing with you that free trade with the US was a very stupid thing for Canada to agree to, but back in the day it was shoved down our throats by the conservative government of the day. Canada is experiencing the consequences of that poor decision right now. That being said, as an export heavy, raw materials-heavy country we have a lot of options. In the first Trunp presidency we signed CETA with the EU, we already get a lot of food imports from Mexico (that won’t change) and since a trump was elected the 2nd time we’ve signed trade deals with Ecuador, and new military agreements with Brazil and the Philippines on top of all our existing allies. There will be more deals that Canada makes, unlike the US, our signature on international agreements actually means something. Canadians aren’t at all like Americans, we are united and we will do anything and everything it takes to protect our sovereignty and our country. Again unlike Americans, we are prepared to go without. We’re a smaller economy and therefore more nimble. We’re doing all kinds of things internally as well. Barring military action by the US on us, I am not that worried and have full confidence in all Canadians to stand up for ourselves and do what we need to do to rid ourselves of the US fascist protectionist isolationist scourge.
All countries are sovereign but some countries are more sovereign than others. If Canada’s priority was protecting sovereignty then they would not be in this position to begin with.
It’s something that has been decades in the making. It will take decades to reverse course. It isn’t going to meaningfully change in the upcoming 5-10 years.
You say Canadians are ready to “go without” but we’re talking about millions of people losing their jobs. A historic spike in poverty. Collapse of many industries. No sane leadership would ever cut off trade with America. National pride doesn’t feed a family.
Long term, sure, maybe there will be a realignment. I doubt it, but it’s possible. The near future is a chaotic one where Canada and Mexico are going to need the economic value from America. We’re headed for troubled times globally.
Unlike the US we don’t hate, despise, and distrust the federal govt. No matter which party is in power. Even our Conservative Party supports gay marriage, trans & LGBTQ rights, equity, gun control and legal weed. Our govt has already put in place supports for those who will lose their jobs due to the US being a bag of dicks. We believe there is a role for federal govt and that it has responsibilities to uphold. We’re much closer ideologically to most European countries so we’re going to continue fostering our excellent relationships with France, Germany, the Netherlands, Austria, etc. The US is free to cut down its own national parks for lumber. Enjoy!
There is no greater enemy than a friend betrayed
You can replace Canada with any other country! Europe and the US aren’t really friends anymore these days.
This read as downplaying Canada’s significance for a moment, and then immediately circled back to the US being the isolationist Pariah state it is becoming
I just hope everyone is learning how easily your country can be owned and controlled by outside interest - if your country is filled with uneducated, incurious, and indoctrinated citizens. We have no one to blame but ourselves as we ask The Kremlin to take the wheel.
I cut off a Canadian guy I was friends with recently, this guy agreed with everything Trump was doing.
Told him I don’t associate with Trump supporters, even weirder you’re Canadian.
He said he didn’t support trump, but reads all the policies front to back and agrees with them.
I said ok, bye and blocked his ass.
Wtf is going on?? He had some bullshit reply to everything like he was Canadian maga.
Cant fix stupid!
John Stewart agrees with some of the DOGE objectives.
John Oliver agrees with some of RFKs beliefs.
And I agree the US penny should have ended in the 90s, but fuck everything else the orange turd says.
Even a broken clock is right twice a day. But believing these thieves at face value is dumb. RFK plays into whatever grift gets him more attention and money.
Everyone feels that the government can be more efficient, but literally firing 100k employees without even knowing what they do and they having to try and get them back due to the massive fuckup? And the childish emails they’re sending employees? All within 30 days?? This is amateur hour man, you have to start to think what is their game, how are they benefiting. Crashing the economy so they can buy up more property cheap like in 2018 and COVID years? There is a game plan and we’re not even being thought about, were just fucked
Living in rural Alberta, I am actually fairly amazed how little I encounter Trump supporters since he’s been elected. If they are around, they keep their stupid fucking mouths shut.
I know at least 3 that vocally supported him during the election and have nothing good to say about him now, and the fact that Smith seems like she’s in bed with him has caused them to re-evaluate their UPC support. Polievre is probably still safe because nobody is voting Liberal, but people talk about how he didn’t push back against the tariffs, and it didn’t reflect well on him.
I know they’re still out there, but there’s an Oh Canada streak that’s pretty deep in rural areas countering Trump’s bullshit.
The same forces that created Trump are at work in Canada. And they are supported by US organizations. Have you noticed that suddenly even second tier US politicians have opinions about Trudeau, Carney, and Pollievre? It is the same as Musk in Germany. We are under attack.
Up until a couple of weeks ago, Canada was well on its path to elect a right leaning government. Trudeau has already resigned and his party was in the gutters. So that tells you how majority of Canadians have been feeling. There is extreme false-facts-driven anti-immigrant sentiment going around, imo, propagated by the same media that is doing so in the US.
Luckily, Nazi musk and his orange monkey’s moves have taken off the veil for some Canadians so there is still some hope for sanity prevailing in their upcoming elections.
Eh Canada was on track to elect the conservatives because the liberals have been in 10 years and fptp trends to a two party system.
Someone I know just keeps telling me he disagrees with every policy that’s bad, while also saying he agrees with Trump for 50 things per the 5 he disagrees with.
Anyway that relationship is very sour as you can imagine
They’re the Austrian who likes Hitler.
That’s a problem we have globally. Although it might seem like Trump style populism vs Canadian neo-liberalism(with all it’s pros and cons), we’re both purple. You guys just have a bit more right wing red in the dye mix. It’s plausible that Canada elects our own Trump then we can both be stupid.
The only ideology that has a chance at stopping the populist wave is Sanders style social democracy because it addresses the same core issue of wealth disparity. But it doesn’t look like anyone is electing that anytime soon.
I’ve met people like that here in the UK too. Trump has this incomprehensible charisma for arseholes the world over.
Reich wing populism is on the rise, globally.
So, he might hate Trump, but he love the Canadian version.
Not enough, it should be 100% and another thing if we have a surplus that we sell, why the fuck is electricity so expensive in Ontario!?
Why is electricity so expensive in Quebec? Because fuck the people that’s why 😑
I don’t pretend to know all the ins and outs of commerce but I do know Canadians are also getting fucked by Canada. Electricity, lumber, construction materials are artificially expensive as fuck. Since covid the price skyrocketed because of price fixing and no-one did shit and they stated high.
Same with food prices, telecom… I love Justin standing up to Trump, but it’s also true that he’s failed protecting the average Canadian. Corporations have run amok and no-one has stood in their way.
Do what you have to do it’s all good. I’m going to be part of the brain drain in this country. My wife and I are POC we are guaranteed first class tickets to death camps or be made slaves for existing. Our populations have been marginalized and kicked in the ribs for centuries. We have no reason to fight or to ‘stay and fix the country’ any more than the German Jews of last century did. I don’t want to be made responsible for what racist whites have enabled to happen in this country.
I’ve got quite the resume and I’ve been having trouble finding sponsors overseas. I would love to be a part of the brain drain.
I’m about to get my Mexican permanent residency 🥳
Life Pro Tips:
To USA Residents: If electricity is too expensive, you could always save money by shiplifting 😉 (go for the big corporate chains)
you could also consider creating a militant (as in, try to get some artillery) tenant’s union and reclaim your living space from your landlords.
Shiplifting? Settle down popeye
yaRrr 🏴☠️
(sorry my pirate brain must’ve subconsciously took over 😉)
I like it, but I’m a little confused.
Why does an individual province determine trade policy? Is this normal for Canada?
The deal is between the provincial utility, which provides the electricity, and the state utility. In the USA, the federal government controls most resource rights. In Canada, it’s the provinces. Comparatively, provinces are a lot more powerful than states are. As I understand it.
Yes, and we even have a lot of interprovincial trade issues. Although with what is happening with the US, we are trying to simply cross provincial trading.
Afaik Quebec is also able to block things like oil pipelines and stuff
I’m ok with this and live in one of the affected states.
And Trump cares that these blue states will be cut off why?
Maybe a state like NY votes blue in state wide elections, but they vote in a lot of Republicans for the House in districts outside if NYC
We are blue in cities… a lot of house support for Trump comes from those red NYS districts.
Michigan is a blue state?
No, but the other two are, and New York in particular is a very notable blue state.
